New train control system for blue line
A new train control system of a type already widely used in other cities will be tested out on the metro’s blue line and then extended to the rest of the system. It’s not a cheap experiment, expected to cost $565 million, and be working by 2028.
The existing control technology dates back 50 years to the origins of the metro system.
Update to add the Gazette and to ponder why this, why now? Maybe the old system really is not sustainable, and rather than being maintained and repaired, needs to be replaced, if not immediately, then soonish. Eventually your technology gets so old you can’t even get replacement parts – as happened with the old MR‑63 metro trains.
But it’s hard to believe that imperfectly spaced metro service is a more pressing fix than, say, better bus service.
Also, why the blue line?
Blork 14:35 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
I know that it’s necessary to update such tools, but half a billion dollars? For control system? And you just know that by the time it’s up and running it will be 2032 and cost $900 million. Yikes!
steph 15:38 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
I’m not an expert, but the name of the new system is in english… the old one was in french. I don’t think the new system will work for Quebec. We will have to re-invent our own.
Blork 18:19 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
Probably the blue line because that’s the one with the lowest level of catastrophe if (when?) the system breaks down.
carswell 19:00 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
The STM will have to have a control system for the blue line extension, not coincidentally to be completed by 2028. Instead of installing the old system, which would soon have to be replaced, it makes economic and organizational sense to go with the new system and thus to start the upgrading of the existing lines’ systems with the remainder of the blue line.
I suspect they’re feeling pressure to focus on this as opposed to bus service because of the rush hour crowding on the orange line that followed its extension to Laval. The number of riders is currently under pre-pandemic levels but they’re probably looking forward and may still be blinkered by the métro-boulot-dodo mindset that envisions downtown returning to its former glory.
DeWolf 20:11 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
I just looked up what New York is spending to do the same kind of work across its entire system and the price tag is apparently C$3.75 billion. So I guess this kind of work is extremely expensive, but… why?
JaneyB 20:42 on 2023-01-23 Permalink
This is where we need to hear from Ant6n. Where is he, btw? (From twitter, it seems at the anti-coal protests in Germany but still…).
Kate 12:18 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
JaneyB, it seems he’s gone back to Germany, but he’s not a personal friend so I don’t know further details.
DeWolf: I imagine they have to extend cabling for a complex feedback system all through the network. They probably can’t reuse any of the hardware that’s already in place – and New York’s subway is much older than ours, so they’d be dealing with even older and more crufty stuff in place. And rats.
carswell 12:38 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
These systems also have to have a lot of fail-safes and redundancies built into them. That can’t be cheap.
CE 13:01 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
Maintenance in New York also has the added difficulty of the system being 24 hours on many (most?) lines.
carswell 13:28 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
Good point, CE. Even here, the work would have to be done between 1 a.m. and 5 a.m. at dog knows what overtime rates. And each morning, the workers won’t just be able to leave things as is until their next shift but have to tidy up the site, yet another extra cost. None of that will apply to the blue line extension, however — yet another argument in favour of starting there.
carswell 18:41 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
A snippet from this morning’s Daybreak interview with the head of the STM, Éric Alan Caldwell (more francophone than anglophone, to go by his accent) just aired on Let’s Go. He confirmed that they’re starting with the blue line because it doesn’t make sense to outfit the extension with a 1970s control system that would soon have to be ripped out and replaced. He also said when the extension is complete, the line will switch over to Azur trains (they’re currently being ordered) in a nine-car configuration. Looking forward to that!
carswell 19:09 on 2023-01-24 Permalink
Interesting 14-minute video about the control system upgrade from a knowledgable Toronto transit geek.
https://youtu.be/vgUwfk2g_w8
tl;dr The city is making a big mistake with the announced high-priced communications-based control system upgrade to the blue line and should instead take advantage of the opportunity to install platform doors and completely automate the line (which would require a different control system).
Some convincing arguments and lots of shots of other transit systems, including an upgraded line in Paris. The video was obviously made before it had been announced that the line will be switching to Azur cars, which announcement actually strengthens his case.