Sofiane Ghazi, who tried to kill his wife when she was at the late stage of a pregnancy in 2017, has been sentenced to a minimum 15 years because the baby died, although the woman survived. The word “monster” comes to mind.
Updates from August, 2020 Toggle Comment Threads | Keyboard Shortcuts
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Kate
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Kate
Claude Charbonneau, wanted in two murders here this month, was picked up in Trois-Rivières and will be charged in Montreal’s palais de justice Thursday.
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Kate
The transport minister is now saying he’s concerned about the many expropriations still needed to proceed with construction of the blue line. Is this a signal that Quebec’s about to put the project on indefinite hold – again? After all, in June, Christian Dubé – who wasn’t yet health minister at the time – told us to forget about the blue line.
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Kate
The Sulpicians, who hold a vast archive of material connected with the founding of Montreal and other Quebec historical matters, have suddenly fired all their archivists, leaving that material in limbo. Item says most of the folks in charge of the order now are from South America and may not understand its importance here.
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Kate
After 83 years, Moishe’s is closing its restaurant on the Main. Bill Brownstein says they intend to reopen somewhere else, but a plan to move to Victoria Square is off. He also says the building was sold and the resto’s lease was up, so it’s not only the pandemic – but are you telling me that, after 83 years, an outfit like that couldn’t’ve bought the building?
Joey
The real reason seems to be that the new owners wanted to expand to lunch service, which is dicey on the Main (at that price point/style of cuisine). Hardly a ‘renoviction’ type situation… The late-evening special they introduced in recent years was a fairly good deal.
Kate
Joey, I know, I saw multiple mentions of the late evening special, but never got around to trying it.
Also, I never could figure out how that restaurant fit inside that building, I was mildly curious to see how it worked, and now I never will.
Ephraim
The Sunday Dinner special is also a great deal. And Costco has/had discounted Gift Certificates. The decor was definitely very old school and not really i tune with a modern dining room experience, even for a steak house. But still one of the best rib steaks in town.
Blork
An entire Bill Brownstein article that doesn’t mention parking even once!
Zeke
Howdy!
So the question is: When Lenny and Larry sold Moishe’s to SportScene, was the building included in the deal?
Judging by the mailed in hack job by Bill, it was not.
In which case it is evident that the Lighter brothers could care less about the city’s and their father’s “heritage” and more about making sure that their children and grandchildren move from the 1% it into the 0.1%.
Meezly
Moishe’s has a line of steaks, ribs, burgers etc. sold at supermarkets. Does anyone know they’ll continue with that? Hope that’s the case, as it’ll be better than nothing!
jeather
Moishe’s had valet parking, so that wasn’t an issue. I really hope they continue to sell their pickles, which are the only brand I buy.
CE
“Sportscene’s major interest in initially acquiring Moishes had more to do with the retail side of the operation. More than 30 Moishes products, including pickles, coleslaw and steaks, are sold in Quebec at IGA and Costco as well as in other provinces, representing a far larger share of revenues — estimated at about 75 per cent — than the restaurant itself.”
Often when the brand becomes more valuable than the restaurant, the restaurant is kept around to add authenticity to the brand and its associated products. The restaurants of celebrity chefs, for example, often lose money.
jeather
As long as I get my pickles I am happy.
mare
Did Moishe’s ever had a second location? I remember going there after my Canadian Citizen ceremony, it was somewhere near the Olympic Stadium. I don’t eat meat so maybe I’m just misremembering, but I know the brand from their coleslaw.
Meezly
Thanks CE. I obviously did not read the article in its entirety.
Mr.Chinaski
The Three-martini lunch days are far over, it’s amazing that Moishe’s survived being on a 2nd floor for that long. It’s like Ty-Bretz or other old restaurants/institutions in the center of MTL, how can they survive in Covid times?
Ephraim
Have you been to Ty-Breiz in the past decade? Ugh!
Kate
Mr.Chinaski, did you mean “far from over” or “over for a long time”?
Old restaurants have been folding gradually, as is inevitable. The Bar-B-Barn closed up not long ago, and it too had an old-fashioned façade and interior (at least, as far as I’m aware). When an old place like this goes away, the chorus of comments almost always indicates why: “Oh wow, the Xxx closed. I haven’t been there in years!”
I’ve never been in the Ty-Breiz, Ephraim. What’s wrong with it? Or have crepe restaurants simply gone hopelessly out of fashion?
CE
Ty-Breiz is one of those places I’ve passed a million times but have never even thought to try out for some reason. I had no idea what it was by name until I Googled it and immediately knew where it was. I rarely think to try these institutions which are “hopelessly out of fashion” but I should, especially if they’re disappearing (I’ve never been Moishe’s for example but often buy their pickles).
Ephraim
I’ve been there. The first sin and the most telling is that the menu is excessively long…. you can’t stock fresh ingredients for a long menu, especially when you have seafood on the menu. So basically expect frozen ingredients. The music is old as well. It felt like I was in a place that hasn’t updated since the 1940s and really needed someone to come in and update it, from the decor to the menu.
If you really want a galette and un bolée de cidre, try Breizh Café on St Lawrence near Duluth. But if all you want is the galette, Juliette et Chocolat has a small menu with only fresh products.
Crepes are particularly out of fashion, but Americans who visit always want them, because well… Tourisme Montreal keeps on telling them that we are Paris in North America. UGH! And the worst part… they aren’t Parisian either. And of course, they don’t know the difference between a crepe and a galette anyway. It’s in there with questions like “Where can I find frog’s legs on the menu?” You know, the way that some people think that french fries are named after France, when french is simply a synonym for julienne.
Kate
Ephraim, I looked at the menu, and Ty-Breizh has some really classic “French” stuff on the menu – exactly as you say, the sort of thing American tourists probably ask for. I was in a small café in Quebec City a few years ago when some Americans came in – nice enough people, but grievously disappointed that the menu didn’t include onion soup gratiné. I think they imagined every restaurant offered it in francophone parts of the world.
Bill Binns
I think Moishe’s is the only old school restaurant in the city I have never been to. The fact that they advertise heavily at the airport was always a red flag to me.
FWIW – Ty-Breiz has been deemed authentic by my born-and-raised in Vannes wife. It’s the only place in town that I’m aware of where you can get galletes. The service is umm….brusque. Their servers all seem to have been there for 50+ years and are well past taking any crap from customers. Very similar vibe to Ben’s at the end.
MarcG
Read the ingredients on those pickles and you won’t want to eat them again.
Ephraim
Bill – Breizh cafe is run by people from Brittany.
Kate – You should hear the inquiries. Things we haven’t seen on menus in years. French onion soup, beef bourgignon, Coquilles Saint-Jacques and of course, escargot. And then there are the “funny” inquiries… like asking for Chocolate croissants (with the T well pronounced) and having to explain chocolatine/pain au chocolat.
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Kate
The borough of Ville-Marie never had a mayor for long. In 2008, Gérald Tremblay persuaded Quebec to ordain that the city’s mayor was automatically also the mayor of Ville-Marie, and could appoint two of its councillors as well. Now some of its residents want to undo that clause and give Ville-Marie a council and mayor like other boroughs – Projet Montréal has even promised this in the past.
It’s undeniable that residents of that large and central borough have measurably less democratic participation in the city’s governance than the rest of us, so I hope they can get this sorted before next year’s election.
I was just recalling: Tremblay removed Ville-Marie’s status as a normal borough purely to spite Benoît Labonté, remember him? It wasn’t from any theoretical view that the city’s central borough should also be the fief of the city mayor. Which is also a good argument for undoing the clause and returning the borough to normal operations.
Dominic
It really does suck, because there are a few times living downtown it would have been nice to reach out to my borough mayor for hyper-local issues, but its the actual mayor, so it would have been a waste of time.
Kate
That’s almost like having Justin Trudeau as your MP!
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Kate
A man is in critical condition after a fire on St-Urbain near Marie-Anne on Tuesday evening.
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Kate
Two men were shot inside a barbershop in Ahuntsic Tuesday evening. Neither was seriously injured. Someone was also shot in a tattoo parlour in Anjou and there was another, exterior, shooting with no victims found, all along Henri-Bourassa.
JosephB 18:59 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
I agree that he’s a monster and agree with the harsh sentence, but isn’t it inconsistent for society to deny “baby” status when it comes to advocating late-term abortion rights yet, in this case, the foetus is personified as a “baby” because it was expected and wanted? Is the only thing that determines whether an unborn foetus is a clump of cells or a human “baby” the wishes of the pregnant person? How does this work? It seems there’s something in the ethics of our discourse that needs to be worked out and cleared up.
JaneyB 19:11 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
@JosephB – yeah, I wondered the same since foetuses do not have rights as far as I know and no one wants to venture into that thorny realm. In CBC’s coverage it turns out the foetus was subsequently born but succumbed as a result of injuries from the stabbings in utero. So I guess that’s the basis for their ruling.
Kate 19:12 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
I knew this would come up. That woman was 36 weeks pregnant. Women don’t get abortions at 36 weeks – even a late term abortion is not at 36 weeks. A fetus at 36 weeks can normally survive on its own, and they said this baby breathed for awhile despite the serious injuries.
Ephraim 20:21 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
Jewish law doesn’t hold that it’s alive until actually born. And even then, it’s 30 days before you would have to sit shiva.
Chris 21:10 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
>Jewish law doesn’t hold that it’s alive until actually born
A fine example of 3000 year old knowledge that’s obsolete. Even an amoeba is alive. Unborn foetuses are clearly alive. Their being alive isn’t denied by either pro- or anti-abortionists, not that I’ve ever heard.
JosephB 21:23 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
In this case the foetus was 36 weeks, but we often here expectant couples and their friends talking about the “baby” inside the belly or on the ultrasound or whatever. Some of those same people then turn around and talk about a woman’s right to choose and a foetus being a clump of cells and not human etc in a different context. So my question remains about how we work out the ethics of it all. Is a foetus a “baby” only when it’s wanted and a clump of cells when unwanted?
Kate 22:24 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
JosephB, this is not the place to split those hairs. The woman in the original story was very close to term, and the offspring she was carrying was viable outside the womb. This has nothing to do with abortion law and freedom of choice.
Chris, you’ve been beating that horse a long time. Laws exist so human decisions can be made. Jewish law says, as Ephraim reminds us, that fetal and newborn life are in a liminal area, but that we can draw a conceptual line where one is needed. That’s really quite wise and in no sense obsolete. You should stop assuming that a modern rationalist (you) has the ultimate and exclusive understanding of human existence. Older modes of belief can contain wisdom you haven’t considered.
Kevin 22:56 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
Canadian jurisprudence has the same definition of alive as Jewish law: it’s not alive until it’s born and breathing. So yes, you can get an abortion at any time. 4 years ago a Quebecer had one at 35 weeks.
https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/montreal-woman-who-had-late-abortion-says-she-made-the-right-decision
And I say jurisprudence because we have no law defining this: it’s all based on legal precedents.
Michael Black 22:58 on 2020-08-19 Permalink
Women can be devastated if a baby is still born, or dies shortly after birth.
And women can decide they don’t want to be pregnant.
It depends on the woman, it likely also depends on other things in the woman’s life.
There’s no contradiction.
Here, the woman seems to have made a decision, and the baby was killed.
Dhomas 03:57 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
3 of my kids were born at 37 weeks and they are happy and healthy.
A 36 week foetus is “viable”, in that it would likely survive being born at that point in the pregnancy. It would probably need some additional hospital care, as its lungs might still be developing.
The general consensus is that abortions should occur before the 20th week of pregnancy unless, as in the case mentioned by Kevin, there is some medical issue with the foetus or a risk to the mother’s life.
It’s not “law” that a foetus after 20 weeks is considered “alive”, but there are some laws that seem to point in this direction. For example, a mother who gives birth to a stillborn child after the 20 week mark is still entitled to maternity leave, though she wouldn’t get parental leave (https://www.canada.ca/en/services/benefits/ei/ei-maternity-parental/special-circumstances.html).
So, to answer JosephB’s question, many people would consider the 20 week mark the magic number where the foetus would be considered a baby and alive and no longer a “clump of cells”. Late-term abortions after 20 weeks can be seen as a form of euthanasia, in order to avoid suffering.
jeather 08:47 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
I believe the reason this was prosecuted as a murder was because the fetus did survive to be born and to take a breath before dying of stab wounds.
Also, Jewish law states that a fetus/baby/whatever becomes a full person/human at birth (once the head is out, or more than half for a breech birth), not “alive” — lots of things are alive and not people.
Chris 08:49 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
>Jewish law says, as Ephraim reminds us, that fetal and newborn life are in a liminal area
He didn’t say liminal, he said ‘[not] alive until actually born’. Sounds quite definitive to me.
>You should stop assuming that a modern rationalist (you) has the ultimate and exclusive understanding of human existence.
I wasn’t making some sociological comment on the human condition. “A foetus isn’t alive until actually born” is simply a factually false statement, understandable 3000 years ago, but untenable today.
Maybe Ephraim meant something more wishy washy like “personhood”, that’d be different.
Kate 08:54 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
Chris, my point about “liminal” was in response to Ephraim’s “30 days before you would have to sit shiva” – in other words, a very new baby is understood to be fragile, and while it is a person, you wouldn’t be obliged to hold a ceremony for its death till it’s got more of a hold on life.
I think this has been a good discussion. It’s clear that this judgement has nothing to do with abortion rights. The fetus was born, and lived a very short few moments.
Chris 09:00 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
23 points for use of the word “liminal” BTW 🙂
jeather 09:26 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
Or maybe Ephraim was just using casual language and not being exactly precise about (English translations of) Jewish definitions of life vs human on this, a blog about Montreal news.
Kate 10:24 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
It’s possible, jeather. Do you think he was right about the 30-days-without-shiva point, though?
Dhomas 10:31 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
@Kate: it looks like the 30 day rule is correct:
“We do not mourn for fetuses (nefalim), and anything which does not live for 30 days, we do not mourn for it.” — Maimonides, Mishneh Torah, Hilkhot Aveilut 1:6
“The infant, for 30 days, even including the full 30th day (if it dies), we do not mourn for it.” – Shulchan Aruch Yoreh De’ah 374:8
Taken from this site: https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/stillbirth-and-neonatal-death/
I suspect that this is being contested now as infant mortality rate is much lower than when these laws were written. So, the excerpt from the site “the family and the community knew of the risks and expected a certain amount of loss” doesn’t really apply too much anymore.
jeather 10:31 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
It’s complicated, as usual there are conflicting answers, and at this point it depends a great deal on your specific rabbi. But that is (was?) custom (not law), that you did not sit shiva, that the burial was done without the parents, etc.
Ephraim 10:36 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
I was definitely being casual about language and not worrying about precision. There are four Hebrew words often used, ruach, nefesh, khai and nishama. Ruach is wind or spirit, nefesh resembles the English word “soul” or the word psyche, khai is alive and nishama is the most like “soul”. And if you look at Genesis 2:7, it uses BOTH words nefesh khayah, or living soul. So, just having a soul doesn’t mean you are alive. And incidentally the Hebrew word for animals is khaiya/khayot, so from the root of the word living. But a human actually possesses nefesh, nishama and ruach to be alive (khai). Nefesh, in particular enters the human at birth, while nishama exists before it. Plants are considered alive, but not with a soul. But animals and birds have souls (nefesh) but they don’t really talk about them having nishama as far as I remember.
Jewish law separates those at 21 weeks, after 21 weeks you bury a fetus, a still birth, a miscarriage or a child under 30 days, but you don’t sit shiva. Which is why Pidyon Haben isn’t done until day 30. Jewish law basically says that they will be included in the “Resurrection of the dead”. (Talk about your bad Zombie movies.)
Chris 18:04 on 2020-08-20 Permalink
>I was definitely being casual about language
I see. Well, all the thread comments before mine were about the exact beginnings of life, humanness, and rights, so I don’t think it was unreasonable for me to assume you were being exact in your language, but thanks for the clarifications.