Tuition change bad for Montreal: Plante
Mayor Plante says the doubling of tuition rates is a serious blow for Montreal and its international reputation. What on earth is wrong with the woman? Doesn’t she want to keep anglos away and protect French?
Update: the finance minister reminds us that McGill, Concordia and Bishop’s are Quebec’s universities too and Paul St‑Pierre Plamondon says of course French‑language universities should be funded better than English ones.
Kevin 17:11 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
She’s allowed to poke fun when the clowns are in Quebec City.
Ian 18:01 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
So here’s a thought. To become a Quebec citizen, you have to live here 3 months and decalre your permanent address to be in Quebec. You can enroll for RAMQ right away, and as soon as 3 months passes you will be switched over to RAMQ which is your proof of citizenship. Of course, this doesn’t work when you are in Quebec as a full-time student.
So here’s what I propose:
Every person that wants to come to Quebec for school gets sponsored by a family from Quebec. We charge them “rent” of, say, 10 bucks a month, starting as soon as the studetn gets their acceptance letter. Some actual rent would have to change hands to make this all above board and legal. As soon as they have a signed lease they can apply for RAMQ online using the address of their new “permanent residence”. After 3 months, citizen of Quebec.
When they do come to Quebec in person to start school, it is as a full-fledged resident of Quebec. Saves $40,000 just like that. I don’t see how this could be effectively or meaningfully policed as it is follows the letter of the law.
Nicholas 19:23 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
To become a Quebec resident for in-province tuition purposes, if you live in another province, you generally have to move to Quebec for 12 consecutive months without being enrolled in a Quebec CEGEP or university. This is Situation 6 from this list. Note there is nothing about RAMQ (which is three months) or voting (which is six months). Being in grade 12 in another province is going to make it impossible to claim Quebec residency. People would have to move to Quebec and do Sec 5 here to make this work, or would have to defer school for a year (some of my out-of-province friends did this, working restaurant jobs).
Ian 19:29 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
hmm good point…
but I see from situation 5 that there are no limitiations on a sponsor…
Ian 19:36 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
p.s. I took a year off between high school and university to work and build up some funds to move to Quebec, but I still kept my Ontario residency as they gave more in student loans thant the QC government gave in bursaries. In retrospect I should have gone with the bursaries as I paid off my loans over 10 years with no help from my family …
TBH I didn’t know I could have become a QC resident in the meantime until a friend from here told me halfway through first year 😀
dhomas 19:45 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
Just a gentle reminder that PSPP is an alumnus of McGill University. Do with that information what you will.
Nicholas 20:12 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
Sponsor means person who sponsored you to immigrate to Canada, which is going to be a family member (or spouse). At least now all this is made (somewhat) clear online; back in the day I’m sure they weren’t explaining it unless requested.
Nicholas 20:17 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
Paul Wells, in an excellent piece on the incoherence of all this, points out Girard, the finance minister, also went to McGill. Paul also links to this piece from Alex Usher that explains the proposals much better than the rest of the media has done, as he points out especially “given that none of the Quebec dailies (AFAIK) have an education beat reporter”.
JP 22:42 on 2023-10-18 Permalink
To add to what dhomas said, not only is he an Alumnus of McGill, he also went to Oxford and Lund. I’ve always felt like the elites were/are trying to block access to opportunities that they themselves will continue to benefit from. I’m sure their children will pick whichever schools in whichever part of the world they want, be bilingual if not trilingual, etc.
CE 07:42 on 2023-10-19 Permalink
My situation as a student I was similar to Ian’s. When I was accepted to Concordia, tuition for an out of province student was about the same as it would have been as a resident in my home province. It wasn’t until I got here that I found out that I could get Quebec tuition rates and Quebec loans and bursaries if I got residency. My second year, I just took two classes one semester and none the second . The next year, I was able to get the Quebec rate. After graduation, the total I owed in loans for my first year was about equal to what I owed for the next three years as a Quebec resident.
When students from other provinces are planning on studying in Quebec. I always advise them to defer their first year, move to the province and do the subsidized French classes while working then by the end of the year, they’ll have good French and cheap tuition.
steph 08:15 on 2023-10-19 Permalink
I know it’s pennies in the bucket, but our provincial coffers are empty. Do we really need to be sharing these `loop holes`?
Joey 08:53 on 2023-10-19 Permalink
I would imagine that the savings @CE realized would probably more than offset by the diminished lifetime earnings associated with ending school one year later, though obviously at that age people are more concerned with short-term finances rather than long-term earning potential.
Anyway, while this policy is both dumb and incoherent (as Alex and Usher and Paul Wells point out, is the problem that non-Quebecers are leaving too soon after their studies – absconding with the benefits of Quebec’s cheap education without meaningfully contributing to the province’s tax base – or staying too long – diminishing the prevalence of French in Montreal in the long term), it tickles me that all of a sudden the official university position is that increasing tuition will have a major impact on enrolment. Obviously the scale of the increase is different than, say, what Charest was proposing, but I can’t imagine there’s a lot of logical coherence between what the universities are saying now and what they were saying in 2012…
Ian 10:40 on 2023-10-19 Permalink
@steph Recognizing that canadian citizenship actually means something despite what Provincial governments would prefer is not some kind of ental gymnastics to justify getting away with something. If anythign it is a valid act of protest – beyond the fact that we know having a lively student culture has contributed to Montreal in particular and Quebec in general for decades.
The coffers aren’t empty. The fat raise the MNAs gave themselves is proof of that. This is about ehtnonationalism, not money.
Kevin 11:03 on 2023-10-19 Permalink
@steph
If this was a decision based on money, Legault wouldn’t be giving money to the Olympic Stadium, a third link in Quebec city, and the countless battery/car companies setting up shop from Becancour to Brossard.