City to rethink pedestrianizing Little Italy
City hall decided pretty quickly last week to close St‑Laurent between St‑Zotique and Jean‑Talon to traffic, but since then almost every media source has reported complaints from the SDC Petite‑Italie. Now the city has backed down and promises discussions and a different solution.
DeWolf 10:54 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Milano led the charge on this and while I have no doubt that many of its customers drive there, I wonder how big the proportion could possibly be. It has no parking lot, a very limited amount of on-street parking along St-Laurent and it’s in a densely populated area with a lot of nearby residents who can walk there. Last time I was there, on a not particularly nice day in April, I certainly didn’t see anyone hop into their car after leaving Milano. Maybe they parked a few blocks away, but if that’s the case, how would that be different to what the city wanted to do?
The city cleared botched the plan by not adequately consulting the SDC. (The contrast with St-Laurent and St-Denis on the Plateau is interesting because it seems to be working closely with the respective SDCs on those streets.) But I also think the owner of Milano may be making certain assumptions about his own customer base that aren’t accurate. As someone who shops by foot and on bike—along with virtually everyone else I know—I definitely feel a bit slighted knowing that Milano doesn’t really care about our business.
Chris 11:21 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Even coronavirus is no match for car culture! 🙂
Jack 11:59 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
So roughly 6 parking spots trumps ( sorry ! ) what could be a real interesting experience. With Chris …
Kate 12:45 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Milano got mentioned a lot, too, as DeWolf says, and he makes good points. I would add: like most stores, Milano only allows a certain number of people into the store at a time anyway, right now, so it’s not like they would get any benefit from having a line going around the block.
mare 12:52 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
There will also be *a lot* of road construction going on in the area: Bellechasse and St-Zotique will be rearranged into one-way streets, St-Hubert is still closed, Beaubien is on-way at the moment. Chateaubriand and Christophe-Colomb both lost several lanes because of new, very wide bike paths. I’m all for that, but closing a major, very busy and often overlooked artery might cause even worse traffic jams than we had before this all started, especially when all Lavalites start driving into the city again because taking the Metro during rush hour is a infection trap.
I’m afraid drivers won’t think “Oh, let’s take my bike to ride from Montmorency to work!” when bikes are whizzing by.
I’m afraid they start hating cyclists even more they already do when they’re stuck in traffic and see all that converted road real-estate—*their* roads, that they pay taxes for—being mostly empty because bikes just don’t take that much space when they’re in motion.
Everyone is on edge these days, I drove a little last week and people were even more aggressive and speeding than normal.
If you happen to live on or next to a street with constant traffic jams, the perpetual noise and pollution will be terrible too.
I don’t have a solution, and maybe taking advantage of this pandemic to make giant steps in converting to pedal power is a good idea. But cycling is not an option for everyone, it just isn’t. Even in the Netherlands many people drive.
DeWolf 13:18 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Yes, even in Amsterdam there are people who drive – about 22 percent of all trips, if I recall correctly. That’s a remarkably low number given that it isn’t an especially high density city (outside the historic core quite a bit of it looks and feels like Montreal). It didn’t get there with half-measures. What Montreal is doing today is what Amsterdam did in the 1970s.
But hey, maybe I’m wrong, Val Plante will be booted out of office in the ensuring uproar and Lionel Perez can swoop in and save the day by dismantling all the bike infrastructure and raising the speed limits back to 50km/h. After all, we’re going to save the world by switching to electric cars, so who needs active transport.
mare 15:26 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Amsterdam and Montreal are very different cities.
Car ownership in Amsterdam is very low for various reasons. If you don’t have one you won’t do many trips by car. Owning a car is extremely expensive: cars are more expensive to buy and it’s much harder to keep an older car on the road because of tough inspections (there are areas you can’t enter with a car that’s older than 10 years!). Gas, insurance and road taxes are much higher. Parking is hard and expensive. There are much less parking spots available. No free street parking. All parking spots in the denser neighbourhoods are metered and in paid parking garages (both $8 per hour, $80 per day) or you need a parking permit. Parking permits are for residents only, maximum one per household, and cost $600 to $900 per year. Waiting list for a permit is 2 to 44 months. A few car-owning friends I have in Amsterdam park their car outside the city and commute to it by tram or bike.
Density is 5500 per km2 versus Montreal’s 2700 per km2. (A third of the area of Amsterdam consists of water, so the actual density is even higher).
Public transport is more abundant and efficient. Bus and tram routes are abundant and the stops are further apart so their average speed is higher. There are also a few metro lines and you can even take the train from one part of town to another. Trains leave every 10-15 minutes. Most people commute to other cities by train (almost 10 million people live within 45 train minutes from Amsterdam) and the trains go often and fast. If you go to the train station public transport and cycling is your best option because there’s very little car parking available and it’s outrageously expensive. There are huge free parking garages for bikes.
Population
City centre popular is much younger, mostly students and young professionals and car-less.
Weather
It’s rarely very cold and snow clearing is done with salt. (I had never seen a snowplough before coming to Canada.) It does rain more and it’s often windy.
Amsterdam is IMO actually a terrible city to bike in, way too many tourists and relatively few grade separated bike paths compared to other cities.
Chris 15:26 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
>but closing a major, very busy and often overlooked artery might cause even worse traffic jams than we had before this all started, especially when all Lavalites start driving into the city again
That can be a self-correcting phenomenon though, if alternatives exist. i.e. Lavalites start driving back into the city, find it even more clogged than before, thus even slower than before, and thus they *change their behaviour*. They work from home, they shift their schedule, they take transit, they bike, they relocate, they change jobs, etc. Not everyone will/can of course, but some would, and traffic would go down to a new normal.
One of my favourite examples;
https://grist.org/infrastructure/2011-04-04-seoul-korea-tears-down-an-urban-highway-life-goes-on/
>*their* roads, that they pay taxes for
In case you were not aware, motorist-only fees (gas tax, etc.) pay for a minority of the road infrastructure, general taxation pays for most of it, and that’s money from everyone.
>But cycling is not an option for everyone
Obviously. Driving isn’t an option for everyone either: the young, the old, the blind, etc. We don’t need a single solution, we need many, and cycling is one, and vastly underutilized.
Ian 19:10 on 2020-05-26 Permalink
Oh Chris hates cars and doesn’t care that Milano’s is an institution, I am SO surprised.
I guess when Milano’s sees that more of their clients start riding bikes to carry home 4-5 bags of groceries they will change their tune, maybe all the bicyclists should lead the charge and actually start shopping there.
I admit I have only ever been to MIlano’s on foot, I usually do my groceries locally on foot – but I also admit I have never a purchased more than I could conveniently carry except once – when I took a cab home. People like me will not keep Milano’s open.