Party with 4 seats makes independence plan
The Parti Québécois is making a show of circulating a budget for an independent Quebec, claiming it could save $12 billion over seven years relative to how it does as part of Canada.
I don’t know how many readers of this blog followed the Brexit campaign, but a notorious element of the Leave side was a big red bus with “We send the EU £350 million a week – let’s fund our NHS instead” written on the side.
It was simply a lie, and the UK has been struggling ever since voting to leave the EU. But the difference is that their ruling party led the campaign to leave. In Quebec’s case, it’s a party with four seats.
walkerp 21:49 on 2023-10-23 Permalink
I heard this news over the radio and thought it was the CAQ who had presented it. I was like, buckle up! Then I see hear it is only the sad remnants of the PQ. Too bad.
If you can get your hands on it, I recommend Jane Jacobs “The Question of Separatism”. She makes a very interesting and compelling case for Quebec independence that was quite surprising and eye-opening. We have this smug assumption that an independent Quebec would be an economic shambles and she makes some strong arguments that it actually wouldn’t be and would strengthen both Quebec and Canada.
Kate 22:42 on 2023-10-23 Permalink
Easy to theorize about it if you’ve never lived here.
I like Chapleau’s commentary.
Blork 09:50 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
This reminds me of the 1995 referendum, when there was a popular misconception that if Quebec separated we’d all be paying half as much income tax because we’d no longer have to pay the feds. (No mention of the fact that the Quebec income taxes would obviously double and maybe even triple.)
While the “OUI” side didn’t actively promote this misconception they very clearly and conspicuously did nothing to dispel the notion.
Kevin 10:50 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
The plan released by the PQ was the most optimistic of proposals, based on the idea that not a single company would leave the province, that all foreign trade agreements would automatically transfer to Quebec, that provincial and municipal debts would be financed at 2021 interest levels, that a PQ piastre would be worth exactly as much as a Canadian dollar, and so on.
Anyone who believes that deserves exactly what they get.
walkerp 13:12 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
Norway separated from Sweden in 1905 and both economies have pretty much been kicking ass since then.
Kate 13:41 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
walkerp, we could cite and counter-cite national separation stories, but no two situations are the same. The breakup of Yugoslavia was a shitshow. South Sudan separated ten years ago and has the lowest Human Development Index of all recognized nations. Ireland’s departure from the UK resulted in years of strife. Ditto Pakistan’s from India. People are still fighting over Nagorno-Karabakh. It isn’t always necessary for a given ethno‑religious group to have its own sovereign territory. Often there’s strength and safety within a larger hegemony.
One of the questions I don’t see asked is what about the First Nations and the Inuit? Their deals have been struck long since with the Crown and then with Canada. They might not want to go along with a separated Quebec.
Ian 14:55 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
Last time there was a referendum the Cree and Mohawks were pretty clear that all Treaty land would have to be renegotiated. None of the existing treaties (which are effectively agreements betwen nations) are with an as-yet sovereign “Quebec”.
Given the CAQ relationship with First Nations it’s no shoo-in.
dwgs 16:20 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
I worked at a place that hosted the Much Music coverage of the ’95 referendum (yes, they covered it live). There were various pols and pundits who came by and did hits for the show, the most impressive of which was Matthew Coon Come, who made it very clear that the Cree Nation would be choosing its own path in the event of Quebec deciding to split. He’s the only speaker who received a round of applause.
jeather 16:22 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
Without trying to say I think a separation is good, the histories I am aware of about, say, the breakup of Yugoslavia and Ireland — they weren’t exactly peaceful groups who did a clean mutual separation. Partition was just imposed from above after the UK realised it could no longer run India as a colony. They’re not really good examples to compare Quebec to.
Kate 16:27 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
jeather, secession is never as tidy and friendly as the latest PQ document wants to make it appear.
walkerp 17:28 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
Nor is it necessarily a descent into war and poverty.
jeather 17:54 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
I think there is a middle ground between the perfect plan the PQ is claiming and the Troubles.
Kate 18:53 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
To be blunt, I don’t trust what the U.S. and/or Russia would make of the remnants of Canada if Quebec were to secede. Don’t forget, a secession like that isn’t just about Canada, it’s about what happens to the balance around it.
Quebec secession simply isn’t a smart move. It never has been.
jeather 19:39 on 2023-10-24 Permalink
I swear Kate, you don’t need to convince me separation is a bad idea.