Jarry Park: accusations of voyeurism
Reports of overt voyeurism around the Jarry Park pool are not new this season, but anger has been building on social media along with plans for a vigilante patrol of the park this weekend. TVA is the first media platform to pick up the story.
According to the item, police and park authorities are well aware of the discomfort and unease created by the situation, but since everyone is allowed into the park and the men are not doing anything definably illegal, they don’t feel able to act on complaints.
I should add: I posted this item because a foreshadowing of vigilantism is news. Not because I support vigilantism.
Ian 14:18 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
So if I understand it, if a guy was to put on a bathing suit and go to the pool to ogle girls that’s ok but this is somehow egregious? Seems a little hypocritical. That siad, creeps at pools is a classic, too.
Anyway putting up a tarp around the fence would solve this easily, and have the added benefit of creating some shade.
jeather 14:38 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
Certains tenteraient aussi de toucher le corps des baigneuses en faisant mine de ne pas savoir nager.
No, women would find it gross if a bunch of men were very explicitly ogling them within the pool (which, indeed, is one of the complaints) and taking photos/videos of them. It’s legal, but they could make it unpleasant for the men.
walkerp 16:00 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I am skeptical of some of the amplification of this phenomenon. When I first moved to Montreal, a colleague told me that this happened at Parc Laurier pool (no mention of immigrants back then just old men perverts supposedly). I never actually saw it and we went to the pool quite a few times.
I’ve read the reddit threads and seen the histrionic call for a vigilante patrol (by a person who had never actually been there yet as far as I could tell). I think that something is going on but how pervasive, consistent and obvious it is (and how it is supposedly a large gang of South Asian men), I question. If it is so obvious, somebody would have already confronted them by now. I don’t doubt that there are creepy dudes around and women do suffer from it, but I suspect some right-wing propaganda bots and your typical racists are jumping into threads and exaggerating it or making hints that it is specifically immigrants.
Kate 16:09 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
There was a comment on Reddit from a South Asian woman who said it wasn’t racist to notice that the groups of men were from that part of the world, because women there have the same problem being semi‑mobbed by groups of men if they go out on their own.
Tim S. 17:22 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
The photo illustrating the story seemed pretty obvious to me.
Taylor C. Noakes 17:53 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
To Walkerp’s point, and I’m not trying to diminish or dismiss any of the harassment women face on a daily basis, here or anywhere else:
Again, I’m not saying it doesn’t happen, I just think there’s a bit of a disconnect between what’s being presented as a widespread phenomenon, and the evidence a widespread phenomenon entails.
walkerp 18:35 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
@kate how do you know the poster was a South Asian woman? And yes, while I am sure that is true, just saying that it happens in that part of the world does not actually confirm that it is happening here at the level claimed. These are classic online tactics, stating these little “truths” in a way that don’t seem outrightly racist or xenophobic but reinforce the racist, anti-immigrant agenda.
Kate 18:52 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
All I can tell you is that the poster self-identified that way and didn’t sound like a troll. But since you guys are sure this isn’t happening, or if it is, it isn’t a problem, or that it can’t be being perpetrated by men from a particular part of the world (and the neighbourhood), then I guess it’s all good.
Chris 19:27 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I mean, if you’re out in public, people can look at you. Frankly, they need to make their peace with that reality.
I don’t think we want laws limiting where you can point your head, that’s a slippery slope I don’t want to descend.
walkerp 19:31 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I’m not sure what’s going on and I have already said it could well be a problem. I’m questioning the extremity of the narrative as presented on social media (and parroted by nationalistic Quebecor media).
Tim S. 20:46 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
One thing our society is really bad at is figuring out how to enforce norms that are not illegal. Should it be illegal to look in a particular direction? Of course not. Is staring OK? No. How can we discourage that without dragging people into the legal system? I guess a reddit thread is a place to start, but obviously something more is sometimes necessary.
DeWolf 20:49 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I’ve been to Jarry pool many times and as I’m aware of this weird Reddit obsession with South Asian men leering at women, I’ve kept my eyes out. And honestly I’ve never noticed anything out of the ordinary.
I am sure there have been cases of men making women uncomfortable at the pool. But this has all the hallmarks of an online alt-right hallucination that has little in common with real life. Like Haitians eating cats and dogs in Ohio.
Taylor C. Noakes 21:12 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I suppose the city could put those plastic inserts into the chain-link fence to give bathers more privacy, or better still, plant a cedar hedge along the fence. Or bathers could bring a second beach towel and clothespins and attach it to the fence. Or the city could put up a big sign facing outward saying ‘stop being pervs’. Or the cops park a cruiser next to the pool and we accept the police telling people to move along if they take a seat facing the pool.
I’m in favour of any solution that helps women feel safer in public, no question, but I think it has to go hand in hand with addressing misogynistic behaviours through better education. Maybe this happens in schools, or through advertising, pamphlets, etc.
At a minimum, the city should probably investigate the claims and determine whether they’re legit or not.
Chris 21:48 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
You want the city to spend time and money investigating if people are doing something perfectly legal, and because of a reddit thread?! I think the City has real things to do.
Kate 22:01 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
I was struck, reading these responses, with the contrast with what I was told in comments here about taking photos of people in public without asking their permission. Oh no no no, you mustn’t do that, it infringes on them, it’s a bad rude thing to do.*
But parties of men taking videos and photos (as reported) of women simply trying to have a swim, that’s OK, because it’s legal, and the women simply have to toughen the hell up.
*I have not done any candid street photography since that time.
CC 22:20 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
@Taylor, great that you’re trying to offer solutions to make women feel safe, but the tone—DIY towel hacks, ridiculous signs—comes off as minimizing. It makes raising valid concerns sound unreasonable or authoritarian, which isn’t fair. Nobody’s seriously wanting mass surveillance—just that boundaries in public space be respected. It sounds like multiple people are reporting problems, that deserves more than a wink and a shrug.
walkerp 23:07 on 2025-06-26 Permalink
Nobody is saying it’s okay to take pictures of women at the pool. What we’re saying is that we are skeptical it is happening at the rate and consistency being reported by vague posters on social media.
If I was there and I saw it happening, I would definitely go speak to them. It’s absolutely unacceptable, legal or not. I don’t think I would be alone which is why I suspect it isn’t happening the way it is being reported on Reddit (as Taylor already argued).
Kate 00:35 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
walkerp, this is not the first summer I’ve seen mention in social media of groups of men gathering just outside the Jarry Park pool (sometimes inside it) mostly to gawp at women; this has been a phenomenon over several seasons but obviously depends on the weather.
Women also report being aggressively followed in the park but whether this involves the same men I do not know. Of course this happens everywhere but the number of reports I’ve seen recently is higher than previous years.
jeather 07:37 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
I’m glad we have so many men here to set us straight that the women must be exaggerating or otherwise wrong.
MarcG 08:04 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
I hear a single need being expressed: safety. Safety for women and safety for visible minorities. Certainly we can have both.
Joey 09:07 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
@jeather +1. Reading these comments is really disheartening. Thanks, Kate, for juxtaposing with the street photography discussion.
walkerp 09:51 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
Being skeptical of unsubstantiated social media reports equals not listening to women?
Nobody in this thread (whose word I would take at face value as it’s mostly real people here) has said they have seen the phenomenon. We are all basing this entire argument on a theoretical construct that none of us know is actually happening. This construct is suspiciously common with the long history of anti-immigrant and racist propaganda seen throughout history in this country and others, the portrayal of hordes of overly sexualized, dark skin men with no morals who have come to defile our white women.
What we need is someone to do some real reporting and go up there and scope it out over several weeks. The Rover, maybe?
Tim S. 10:56 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
It’s not unsubstantiated, though – there’s a photo and a series of complaints. Bad things can happen even if they don’t fit your ideological construct.
walkerp 11:50 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
Being skeptical of internet-based mob rule is an ideological construct?
I would recommend reading The Fixer by Bernard Malamud. Relevant to this situation.
JP 12:06 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
I think this should be taken seriously but at the same time, I agree that I think there is some sort of all-night, racist online agenda as well. I don’t personally spend a considerable amount of time at Jarry Park but know of a few friends who live nearby and plan to ask them what they’ve noticed. As a South Asian woman, all I can really say is that it’s a weird time to be South Asian. I’ve never really wished I was White passing before but I do these days…I’ve experienced some hostility lately and am concerned about my career too.
Also, relating to the comment about experiences “back home”…South Asia isn’t homogeneous – just because one South Asian woman commented something doesn’t make it true for everyone. Having been born and raised here, I’ve made sweeping generalizations myself only to be schooled by those who have moved here more recently from there. I will also add when groups of white people do something, somehow their race/ethnicity is never the focus (not saying that it should be).
JP 14:56 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
The only thing I wanted to add is that it’s my understanding that this particular pool hasn’t opened yet this summer. It just opened yesterday according to the city site, so perhaps this is pre-emptive (which is great) for concerns following last year’s season but I feel like these are details that should be mentioned in the article. Don’t make it seem like the pool has been open all June and this is happening right now. I read the comment on Reddit from “a South Asian woman” something about it rings inauthentic to me (might be the edit where it adds “When I refer to South Asians, I am mostly referring to Indians”). I figured that’s obvious…
I ultimately think multiple things can be true…there might be an issue at Jarry Park, there might also be an online racist agenda backed by some groups. All of which should be addressed.
I might actually have to take a break from this blog, Kate, even though I mostly enjoy reading it.
Kate 15:25 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
JP, I have always appreciated your presence here and it pains me to think I could have said anything to offend you. I realize I am guilty of conveying reports third hand, and accept that I may have done wrong. Please believe it is not my intention to use this (or any) story as a stalking horse for xenophobia.
If there is anything I can change, please let me know.
Taylor C. Noakes 18:40 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
re: the pool hasn’t opened yet
And I’m not saying this to deny or dismiss anything, my criticism was primarily focused on how this was reported
@JP – please don’t leave, your insight and perspective is both needed and appreciated. I’d like to think a lot of people learned something here, and that goes both ways
walkerp 18:53 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
Thirded about you not leaving @JP (and I also appreciate you sticking to nuance in your responses).
While we did not agree on aspects of this situation, I believe nobody here is in any way trying to further promote any anti-immigration narratives or propaganda (nor not recognizing the real fear and harassment that women live with).
This is the insidious nature of the right-wing propaganda machine.
Kate 22:56 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
Are we sure the pool hasn’t opened? CTV has a report now, citing a woman who says she was recently being ogled from very close up in the pool area.
On June 21, CTV ran a list of pools opening for the heat wave, and Jarry Park is included.
JP 23:29 on 2025-06-27 Permalink
I stand corrected with regard to the opening date. And, the CTV report seems a lot more credible. I hope this does get addressed and that the area does become safer again for women.
Kate, on a separate note, I’ll definitely keep visiting the blog. I do generally learn a lot from the discussions/comments, and it helps me organize my own thoughts too. I probably just need a break from the news in general.
Kate 00:04 on 2025-06-28 Permalink
Thank you, JP.
We have a group of very good people here.
MarcG 07:24 on 2025-06-28 Permalink
They’ve started opening the public pools earlier over the past few years because of spring heat waves. I’m not surprised the city website wasn’t updated to reflect that.
GC 08:55 on 2025-06-28 Permalink
I don’t think I’ve been to Jarry in 2025, so I’m not going to try to comment on what is or isn’t happening there.
But, some of the comments here are about how badly TVA reported it–and rightly so. CTV did some actual journalism. They sent a reporter on site, they interviewed someone, they put the Reddit threads in a historical context. TVA basically screencapped something they found online and then quoted a bunch of anonymous comments. (It does sound like TVA at least contacted the police, to ask them about it, but that’s about it.) That doesn’t mean the story is made up, but people are right to be extra skeptical about details. Remember the mosque story?
Kate 10:17 on 2025-06-28 Permalink
GC, you mean the bogus claim that a mosque objected when one of the city workers in the street outside the mosque on a Friday was a woman? Debunked here.
Jim 14:35 on 2025-07-08 Permalink
I feel like I need to chime in… For background, I’m an ethnically Indian man(Indian from South Asian) although my mother is from Malaysia, but born and raised in Montréal. This issue is somewhat complex in the sense that:
A) historically men have always leared at women to some extent or another, and that refers to men of any skin colour or culture. I’m not saying that this is acceptable or right, but it is reality. This also true for women towards men, although women have typically been more discreet about it.
B) when you add new immigrants or relatively new immigrants who come from a culture and country where women are more modest with their attire, our more open society creates a kind of “feeding frenzy” when these men are exposed to something that they may have only seen in TV or movies. Again, not to justify the action, but to acknowledge reality.
C) in the case of these Indian men(although maybe not exclusively Indian men), to further excerbate the behaviour, India and Indians generally are incredibly repressed sexually, which is ironic, given that India is the birthplace of the kamasutra. Sex between unmarried couples is still highly frowned upon over there and there are far more men then there are women because of cultural infanticide due to gender. Add to this Indians who are recent immigrants carry the baggage of their culture and are expected to marry indians and even further, within their specific Indian sub group, so they see “white women” as the realization of the fantasies they see in movies.
Obviously this is a generalisation but it’s far more accurate than many would admit to.
So… After this wall of text, sorry about that, BTW, what’s the solution? Very tricky! Leaving out the bad immigration policies of the past decade or so, I think the men need to be (politely) told that this is not OK in our society. It goes against our cultural norms and like it or not THEY need to conform to our norms and not the other way around. When my parents came to Canada in the late 60’s, they new they had to adapt to Quebec /canada customs not the other way around. I was also raised in the quebec/Canada culture (not in the 60’s ). What I learned about India and Malaysia was done at home.
As someone wrote previously, I also think privacy curtains/slats need to be put up on the fencing to deter any learning and life guards need /security needs to “confront” the people in the pool who are acting inappropriately so that they can understand what is and isn’t appropriate.
In a nutshell, my 2 cents and sorry for the novel!