Montreal City Weblog

Kate 21:03 on 2024-04-14 Permalink Reply  

• Ephraim 22:25 on 2024-04-14 Permalink

  But will they ask a clear question? And will they finally be honest enough to tell the people of Quebec that a YES vote means that they lose their Canadian citizenship. Because people still have magical thinking that they get to keep their Canadian citizenship after repudiating the country.

• carswell 07:57 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  The next provincial election is about two and a half years away, an eternity in politics. That said, Plamondon may just have ensured that, if the PQ ends up winning, it will only be as a minority government.

  If so, that wouldn’t necessary derail plans for a referendum. QS, another separatist party, would likely be the king maker. In that case, will the movement go ahead with a referendum that nearly two-thirds of the populace currently doesn’t favour (Plamondon’s framing it as Quebec’s last chance indicates they might be willing to risk everything) and that would surely entail a conscious worsening of the Canada-Quebec relationship in an effort to drum up support?

  A complicating factor: who will be the prime minister in a year and a half? If, as seems likely, it’s Poilievre, who seems more than happy to diminish the federal presence — largely because he’s a tool of the fossil fuel industry but also because allowing a provincial power grab is a probable vote-getter in Quebec — does that pull the rug out from under the separatists? And what happens if the Cons form a minority government in Ottawa with the Bloc holding the balance of power?

  We live in interesting times. And more’s the pity.

• DeWolf 09:08 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  @Ephraim That seems like magical thinking on your part. You’d need to make a few significant changes for that to happen. First of all, you’d need to change the constitution so that any Canadian could have their citizenship stripped for whatever reason (currently it’s only if you’re a naturalized citizen and you committed fraud to obtain that citizenship). Second, you’d need to require all Canadians to hold only one citizenship. Given that 26% of Canadians are immigrants and another 18% have immigrant parents, you’re asking nearly half the population to relinquish whatever other nationality they have.

  I’m not sure most Canadians would be spiteful enough to relinquish their own fundamental rights just to punish Quebec.

• Kate 09:53 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  I’m reminded of the results of a survey years ago, it might even have been for the first referendum, when they found out the majority of Quebec residents expected that, even after separation, there would still be transfer payments from Ottawa, protection and security provided by the Canadian military and so on. And listening to St‑Pierre Plamondon now, going on about how Ottawa is trespassing in Quebec, I feel like it’s still Quebec wanting the status of a sovereign nation but still able to count on the backing of Canada, like someone in late adolescence wanting the freedom of adulthood yet with parents still paying the rent – but don’t enter my bedroom!

  DeWolf: but if Quebec separated, anyone immigrating here would not get Canadian citizenship, presumably, although there would be a generation born that inherited the right to it – unless Canada were to cut that option off.

  If Quebec separates it won’t be long before other parts of Canada join the United States. Alberta might be proud to become the 52nd state.

• Blork 10:00 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  Surveys also showed that many people (probably not a majority, but apparently many) believed they’d no longer have to pay Canadian income tax (correct) but there would be no corresponding change in the Quebec income taxes they’d pay (so, so wrong!). As could be expected, pro-separatists did nothing to dispel this illusion.

• Kate 10:31 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  Maybe a separate Quebec wouldn’t feel the need for any armed forces or postal services?

• Ian 10:49 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  I look forward to the balkanization of the nation of Québec, we can’t even agree that all the boroughs of Montreal are equally important… although Montreal as an island city-state like Singapore would be pretty cool, too.

• carswell 10:59 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  If Quebec separates it won’t be long before other parts of Canada join the United States.

  Am half-expecting that to happen anyway as climate change worsens and the US decides it needs Canadian water to keep the southwest and midwest afloat…

  But if it happens, for whatever reason, francophone Quebecers will soon find themselves wishing for the return of the linguistically enlightened Canadian government. Americanos, especially the rightwing variety, don’t like funny-sounding furriners not speaking English and definitely do not view the States as anything other than a unilingual nation.

• jeather 11:01 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  The example of Brexit should be sobering, but since it’s England god knows no one will look at it.

• Ephraim 12:27 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  @DeWolf – Not my magical thinking. There were several discussion in the past about it and that Canada would likely make it a condition of separation, because it’s essentially seen as repudiating your citizenship.

  Quebec taxes would likely increase, as they would have to pay for services that they currently don’t and of course, wouldn’t get transfer payments which are higher because Quebec is a have-not province. For example, Quebec doesn’t have border guards and it’s questionable how many of them might be willing to move to working for Quebec (seniority, pension, union, pay, etc etc etc.) So many services are federal that we don’t think about it, like air traffic control.

• Uatu 19:47 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  Can I just get a GP first before all this nation building starts?

• steph 20:50 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  I like how the Quebec separatist dialogue props up the separatist Montreal city-state crowds. I really like it.

• Ian 22:46 on 2024-04-15 Permalink

  Well the ethnonationalists spend so much time telling us we aren’t “real” Quebec it’s kind of an obvious next step. I’m sure lots of them would be happy to see us leave.