A visit to the NDN cold storage
Why is this visit by the Journal’s Louis‑Philippe Messier to the cold storage at Notre‑Dame‑des‑Neiges being framed as shocking and “odious”? If you have a lot of coffins you can’t bury all at once, it’s the obvious thing to do.
A more interesting question would be why NDN built this big cold storage in the first place. Were they expecting a strike or were they expecting a pandemic?
Another interesting question is why we bury people in vastly expensive pieces of furniture with elaborate metal handles. Surely a simple shroud would be more environmentally sound?
carswell 10:52 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
Even sounder if the corpse isn’t pumped full of toxic embalming fluids and has any teeth with mercury-laced fillings pulled.
Will probably chose to be cremated but I do find the idea of a green burial appealing.
https://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/spirit-sanctuary
Bert 11:05 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
One reason for the cold storage is because it is difficult / impossible to dig plots in the winter.
As to the coffin question, it’s because the burial industry is a business which is designed to play on the emotions of those left to make these decisions. The best thing anyone can do is make pre-arrangements. One of my parents did it and basically told me “when I go, call this number. Everything is chose, arranged and paid for.”
Nicholas 11:36 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
One of the nicest things you can do for your relatives is to make a document with all your accounts (email it to them and print it out and tell people where you’re storing it). Banks, utilities, deeds/leases, pensions, wills, lawyer/notary name and number, etc. Turn a week-long job of frustration during their time of grief into a few hours. It’s not a legal document, just a handy how-to. Especially helpful if they live in a different city.
Ian 11:40 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
A living will is also a good idea. Stuff like who gets power of attorey if you get dementia, whether you want a DNR, et cetera. Saves a lot of grief and heartache trying to get the right to do your parent’s taxes after they no longer recognize you.
Bert 13:18 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
Add to that, and this may be a touchy one, get power of attorney before you need it. Yes, there are possible family issues to deal with, i.e. siblings, and may not be viable for all. But it will certainly make things easier when needed, be it either for family reasons or questions of competence to authorize / delegate.
Not only is a living will a great idea, but communicating the contents to everyone beforehand is critical. Don’t just put it on a page, put it in people’s heads.
Kate 13:20 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
What do people do if they have no family?
Bert 13:28 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
Kate, that is very much a valid question, and that is close to the heart. You can possibly go to close friends or find a trustee of some sort. In any of these cases, the pre-planning and pre-execution is critical.
Otherwise, you wind up as a ward of the Curator and you get what you get.
MarcG 14:31 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
In Quebec “living will” and “power of attorney” are called “protection mandate”. https://www.quebec.ca/en/justice-and-civil-status/legal-protection/protection-mandate
H. John 17:02 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
The concept of a Living Will, allowing patients to self-select future medical treatment and the person responsible for communicating their choices, originated in the U.S. in the 60’s and 70’s. It’s use accelerated in Canada in the ’90’s because of AIDS – as a way of designating in writing someone who wasn’t a legal relative (before same-sex relationships were legalized).
It’s not unusual to see the term Living Will, even in Quebec. McGill’s Palliative Care Unit uses the term, and used to have a suggested form that families could use. They’re using the term as a way to get people to communicate their health care choices with their families.
In Quebec, to be legally enforceable you have to have a Mandate in Case of Incapacity. If/when you become incapacitated, it comes into force once it’s certified by a court (homologated, aka probated in common law).
Educaloi explains:
https://educaloi.qc.ca/en/capsules/protection-mandates-naming-someone-to-act-for-you/
And the BAnQ has a downloadable booklet:
https://numerique.banq.qc.ca/patrimoine/details/52327/4588020
Here’s a Quebec health care page that talks about options to make sure your choices are known:
https://www.ciussswestcentral.ca/programs-and-services/quality/clinical-ethics-service/advance-directive-living-will-and-mandate/
The Mandate expresses your wishes; but, the final decision rests in the hands of the doctor.
The more recent Quebec law on “Advance Medical Directives” is legally binding on the doctor, and overrides a Mandate if there is a conflict.
The Advanced Medical Directive allows you to accept or refuse care in 3 situations:
If you are suffering from a severe and incurable medical condition, in an end-of-life situation
If you are in a coma that is deemed irreversible or in a permanent vegetative state
If you are suffering from severe dementia, with no possibility of improvement (Alzheimer-type dementia or other advanced-stage dementia, for example)
For each situation, you can accept or refuse the following:
Cardiopulmonary resuscitation, ventilator-assisted breathing or breathing assisted by another device, dialysis treatment, forced or artificial feeding, forced or artificial hydration.
You can download a form from the RAMQ. Once filled in, signed, witnessed, and returned by mail, it’s registered.
https://www.ramq.gouv.qc.ca/en/citizens/health-insurance/issue-directives-case-incapacity
There are a number of concerns about AMDs:
https://irpp.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Improving-Advance-Medical-Directives.pdf
Blork 17:56 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
A container or box of some sort is useful in environments where the deceased stays around for a few days for a wake or similar sort of “viewing.” It’s also useful for transporting the deceased, as it’s easier to carry a box than to flop a body on and off a stretcher-like thing for moving them around. It also makes for neater storage while waiting for the grave to be dug.
As to why some people feel it needs to be a refined piece of furniture with flashy bling all over it, there’s no short answer for that but plenty of long ones in the various literatures of psychology and anthropology.
The short version is: humanity generally doesn’t make much sense collectively. The only reason why we’ve put people on the Moon or eradicated polio or whatever is because of the work of some individuals. As a group we’re a mess, and highly susceptible to stupid phenomenon that manifests in groups but is repeated by individuals. For example, poor people paying for elaborate weddings, or bereaved adult children making up for never calling and never writing by making a big show of putting Mom in a $50,000 coffin.
Ian 21:03 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
I am currently in the process of taking care of an elderly relative whose affairs are very much not in order.
As others have pointed out, “power of attorney” and “living will” are not the precise terms used by the courts in Quebec but these are understood and used by notaries, lawyers, and the hospitals.
Let’s not forget that “derogation” is a term only used by English speakers in Quebec, everywhere else it’s a “waiver” … which ironically also came into use in English through French.
Kate 22:56 on 2023-09-25 Permalink
MarcG, H. John, thank you for the links and information.
carswell 11:37 on 2023-09-26 Permalink
Point taken, Ian, but, as always, it’s not that simple. Here’s the Termium Plus (Canadian government’s terminology database) entry for derogation. Other entries starting with the term will be found in the entry listing.
https://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-fra.html?lang=fra&i=1&srchtxt=derogation&index=frt&codom2nd_wet=1#resultrecs
Orr 20:44 on 2023-09-27 Permalink
On the other hand, if you hate your children, not leaving a will is the way to go.
I’m talking about my grandfather, and he held a grudge.
(My actual advice: get a will, and get it today!)